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Post by linsi on Jun 7, 2006 2:51:44 GMT 10
God's law could not save us but it served to make men realize their need of Christ through Whom alone they could be justified by faith.
We are justified then by our faith in Christ.
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Post by supremo on Jun 8, 2006 10:02:17 GMT 10
I AGREE!!!
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Post by linsi on Jun 21, 2006 19:05:32 GMT 10
yep
kaya nga yang moral law na yan, ibinigay para ma emphasize ang kasalanan ng tao, dahil kung walang batas walang kasalanan
ex/
nagtapon ng cigarrette butts sa kalye dito, biglang tnaong nung nagtapon, teka bawal ba ang magtapon ng cigarette butts dito?
hmm wala namang nakalagay..
that means pag walang batas, walang bawal, at pag may batas na bawal that means violation o kasalanan
the law could not save us, it cannot justify us, kaya nga there was redemption and grace dahil alam ng Diyos na hindi makakasunod ang tao sa batas.
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Post by linsi on Jun 21, 2006 19:09:20 GMT 10
we are justified by our faith in christ dahil walang makakasunod sa batas, kung batas ang babasehan walang maliligtas, kaya ang justice ng Diyos ay ibinigay niya through our faith in christ para ang tao ay maligtas.
first attempt sa garden of eden, hindi nakasunod si adam at eve, samantalang iba ang situasyon nila nun kesa sa ngayon, kung noon na ideal ang kanilang buhay and they walked everyday with God hindi pa rin nakasunod sa command ng Diyos paano pa ngayon ang tao, therefore God has planned something more wonderful than those laws..
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Post by linsi on Jun 22, 2006 16:27:49 GMT 10
kaya nga dun sa naging argument na let your conscience be your guide, conscience lang ang nakakapagbigay ng guilt or remorse,pag nagkasala ka, at tama ang moral law ng Diyos ay guide, but nanatiling guide lang yan dahil alam ng Diyos na hindi masusunod ng tao..
hindi ito makakapagligtas, dahil nga puro violations nga eh, walang nakasunod.
;D
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Post by bangzhik101 on Jul 3, 2006 14:39:52 GMT 10
If God's laws can not save man...what is the purpose of God enacting His laws to man if man would not be saved anayway by following them?
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Post by linsi on Jul 5, 2006 2:01:30 GMT 10
If God's laws can not save man...what is the purpose of God enacting His laws to man if man would not be saved anayway by following them?
kuya banshik
First man could not follow, God did not expect man to follow the laws, dahil sa free will nakita ng Diyos na ang tao ay mas "inclined to sin"
yun ngang "thou shalt not commit adultery" sa old testament, hindi nasunod ng tao, sa new testament lalong tumaas ang level ng batas "
Matthew 5:27,28 You have heard that it was said, "donot commit adultery But i tell you anyone who looks at a woman lustfully had committed adultery with her in his heart naku lalong humigpit,
lalo nang hindi makakasunod ang tao
kaya kung batas ang magiging batayan walang maliligtas dahil lahat ng 10 utos ng Diyos ay hindi nasunod lalo na ang matthew 5:27,28.
By these, God knew that man could not comply and therefore no one can be saved by the laws.
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Post by linsi on Jul 5, 2006 2:08:37 GMT 10
The law was given to intensify man's knowledge of sin.
a man's conscience will bear inner witness to him that he is a sinner, but through God's published Law, man has a clearer knowledge of what sin is.
apostle paul stated in Romans 7:7 i had not known lust, except the law had said "thou shalt not covet.
Dahil sa batas, we learned that sin is breaking God's commandments, sin now takes on the character of transgression .
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Post by linsi on Jul 5, 2006 2:10:24 GMT 10
the law was given to reveal the holiness of God.( lalo na sa ceremonial laws)
Romans 7:12
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Post by linsi on Jul 5, 2006 2:15:50 GMT 10
the law was given to lead men to Christ.
the law is called "schoolmaster"
"wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. Galatians 3:24
the law could not save but it served to make man realize the need of Christ through Whom alone they could be justified by faith.
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Post by linsi on Jul 5, 2006 2:19:03 GMT 10
kuya banshik
the law through its offerings, priesthood and the tabernacle pointed to the cross of Christ as the only way of salvation and access to God.
once Christ came and was received as Lord and Saviour through faith, the Law as a means of obtaining salvation, was done away with.
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Post by linsi on Jul 5, 2006 2:21:37 GMT 10
The scriptures teach that on the death of Christ, the believer is delivered, not only from the curse of the law, the penalty imposed upon him by the law--- but from the law itself
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Post by linsi on Jul 5, 2006 2:26:06 GMT 10
Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us for it is written cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree Galatians 3:13
thus the believer can realize that he is not "under the law, but under grace" Romans 6:14
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migy
Moderator
moderator in his designated rooms
Posts: 2,544
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Post by migy on Jul 5, 2006 2:43:00 GMT 10
By Grace also we are free from the bondage of Curse... Hi Kuya Banshik and Linds...
Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us for it is written cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree Galatians 3:13
thus the believer can realize that he is not "under the law, but under grace" Romans 6:14
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Post by supremo on Jul 5, 2006 3:37:14 GMT 10
Clear presentation between the law and grace through faith.........
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Post by bangzhik101 on Jul 11, 2006 13:13:49 GMT 10
Yours: kuya banshik
First man could not follow, God did not expect man to follow the laws, dahil sa free will nakita ng Diyos na ang tao ay mas "inclined to sin"
yun ngang "thou shalt not commit adultery" sa old testament, hindi nasunod ng tao, sa new testament lalong tumaas ang level ng batas "
Hi Linsi,
1. Ano ang nauna... ang free will ng man o ang batas ng Diyos (God's Law) ?
2. Was free will designed by God so that man would commit sin? Or was free will designed by God in order for man to serve and love God?
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Post by linsi on Jul 11, 2006 14:18:29 GMT 10
From kuya banshik
Hi Linsi,
1. Ano ang nauna... ang free will ng man o ang batas ng Diyos (God's Law)
a quick reply balik na lang me maya, gud am kuya banshik ( will email you later hehe )
nauna po ang free will ng tao, dahil wala pang batas nun. yung bilin kay adam na wag kakain ang forbidden fruit is personal commandment not law.
between free will and the Law, free will was given first upon angels and the first man.
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Post by linsi on Jul 12, 2006 4:20:59 GMT 10
2. Was free will designed by God so that man would commit sin? Or was free will designed by God in order for man to serve and love God?
I don't think God would want us to sin, a very clear explanation is God's intention for man eversince is eternal bliss and when man sinned, He at once designed redemption so that man could avail of salvation.
I personally think that free will was given by God to man because God loves all of us so much that he gave us the freedom to choose. He gave man the power of choices. In other words, He could never love us if His will and choice would dictate a beloved. that would not be free will and therefore would undermine God's sincerity about his gift of freedom to us.
but man was inclined to sin, and has the affinity for evil.
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Post by bangzhik101 on Jul 12, 2006 12:01:26 GMT 10
Yours: nauna po ang free will ng tao, dahil wala pang batas nun. yung bilin kay adam na wag kakain ang forbidden fruit is personal commandment not law.
between free will and the Law, free will was given first upon angels and the first man.
Hi Linsi,
In my opinion, free will of man was created after the Law.
(1) In the order of creation of the world and mankind, it was very evident that Natural Law already existed even before man was created.
(2) It would not be consistent for God to create free will and then define its purpose afterwards. Thus, God already defined the purpose of free will before creating it and giving it to man.
Conclusion:
God intended man to follow His Laws. God created the Law first in the order of creation (the world and the universe first - Natural law) because man it itself even serve the purpose of Moral law. God intended man to do good, thus God already defined the Laws in which He wanted Man to follow prior to man's creation.
Free Will was never designed by God in order for man to sin, but rather sin is a choice that man takes in abuse of the gift God gave man.
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Post by linsi on Jul 12, 2006 12:50:48 GMT 10
Hi Linsi,
In my opinion, free will of man was created after the Law.
(1) In the order of creation of the world and mankind, it was very evident that Natural Law already existed even before man was created.
hello kuya banshik
hindi po, ang tinutukoy nyo ay natural law and tinutukoy ko ay moral law.. natural law goes with creation the moment it was created by God, example "law of gravity".
i agree that natural law existed together with creation becoz it is creation itself.
Moral law existed only when man begin to sin.
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Post by linsi on Jul 12, 2006 12:54:58 GMT 10
(2) It would not be consistent for God to create free will and then define its purpose afterwards. Thus, God already defined the purpose of free will before creating it and giving it to man.
the definition of free will is freedom, and yes it was given to man the moment man was created, it is like giving the breath of life upon man during creation, conscience and free will are all given in the mind .
Free will must be tested and when God saw that man was inclined to sin, he declared moral law to define sin which takes the character of transgression. ex/ "thou shalt not covet"
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Post by linsi on Jul 12, 2006 13:00:53 GMT 10
Conclusion:
God intended man to follow His Laws. God created the Law first in the order of creation (the world and the universe first - Natural law) because man it itself even serve the purpose of Moral law. God intended man to do good, thus God already defined the Laws in which He wanted Man to follow prior to man's creation.
Free Will was never designed by God in order for man to sin, but rather sin is a choice that man takes in abuse of the gift God gave man.
No, God did not expect man can comply with His moral law after the fall because adam's fall brought in more choices of evil after they have eaten the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil, man's choice was towards, evil and not towards good.
when God saw this He designed a plan for redemption, that all who accepts Christ through faith by grace would be justified, freeing man from the bondage of the law because man could never keep the laws.
We are now under grace.
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Post by linsi on Jul 12, 2006 13:04:21 GMT 10
Free Will was never designed by God in order for man to sin, but rather sin is a choice that man takes in abuse of the gift God gave man.
I have stated that God gave free will to man to express his love which is just. and you got it right when you said sin is man's choice.. that is what i am exactly trying to explain that man is inclined to sin therefore, when law takes the form of transgression, man sinned evermore, Redemption was given to man through the death of Christ on the cross, not through the law, and that whosoever believe in him by faith through grace is justified and will never perish.
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Post by bangzhik101 on Jul 12, 2006 15:51:40 GMT 10
Yours: Moral law existed only when man begin to sin.
Hi Linsi,
If Moral Law existed only after man began to sin, what law was applied by God when the fallen angels rebelled and sin?
Hindi ba Moral Law is based on the question of good and evil?
What about the Law that God created to establish good from evil before man was created? Are you saying God only created this law after man sinned?
Comment: I do not think so. The mere fact that God already established the precepts of good and evil and applying His instruction to man regarding the Tree of Knowledge (good and evil) meant that God had already applied the basis of Moral law prior to man committing sin.
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Post by bangzhik101 on Jul 12, 2006 15:55:21 GMT 10
Yours: the definition of free will is freedom, and yes it was given to man the moment man was created, it is like giving the breath of life upon man during creation, conscience and free will are all given in the mind .
Free will must be tested and when God saw that man was inclined to sin, he declared moral law to define sin which takes the character of transgression. ex/ "thou shalt not covet"
Hi Linsi,
You never answered the question: "Was free will designed by God so that man would commit sin? Or was free will designed by God in order for man to serve and love God?"
What you explained is the definition of free will but not its purpose. Even (for the sake of argument) we accept that man is inclined to sin - the prupose for which Free Will was created has to be defined.
Was free will created so man could do good or do evil?
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Post by bangzhik101 on Jul 12, 2006 15:59:02 GMT 10
Yours: No, God did not expect man can comply with His moral law after the fall because adam's fall brought in more choices of evil after they have eaten the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil, man's choice was towards, evil and not towards good.
when God saw this He designed a plan for redemption, that all who accepts Christ through faith by grace would be justified, freeing man from the bondage of the law because man could never keep the laws.
We are now under grace.
Hi Linsi,
If God expected that man would not comply with His moral law after the fall, what is then the purpose of instructing Man (a) to follow His Laws (b) to do good?
Why would God design aplan of redemption for a creature/being who is not going to follow His laws anyway?
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Post by linsi on Jul 12, 2006 16:03:29 GMT 10
Hi Linsi,
If Moral Law existed only after man began to sin, what law was applied by God when the fallen angels rebelled and sin?
hello kuya banshik
there are several kinds of laws, would you do me the honor to identify each?
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Post by linsi on Jul 12, 2006 16:07:06 GMT 10
Hi Linsi,
If Moral Law existed only after man began to sin, what law was applied by God when the fallen angels rebelled and sin?
di ba you said that angels have superior intelligence so they were judged right away when lucifer rebelled?..
there was no law indicated in the bible for angels during the time of lucifer as the morning star and since you said which i agreed that angels were created with superior intelligence so much so that the first angelic rebellion met the final judgment a punishment for them to fall and second death awaits them, that answers your question about this matter.
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Post by linsi on Jul 12, 2006 16:08:09 GMT 10
Hindi ba Moral Law is based on the question of good and evil?
God's moral law is specifically about the 10 commandments given at the mount of sinai.
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Post by linsi on Jul 12, 2006 16:12:01 GMT 10
What about the Law that God created to establish good from evil before man was created? Are you saying God only created this law after man sinned?
at first there was no evil, for God created only what is good. before man was created there was no moral law because there was no sin and rebellion amongst men, similar to the angels, God created his creation which was only good.
Yes, read back about what i posted about the law, (moral laws)
God created his moral laws after man sinned grieviously in wickedness,
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