|
Post by rafael on Sept 7, 2008 21:06:24 GMT 10
10 questions that every intelligent Christian must answer
Exodus 35:2 God demands we kill everyone working on a sabbath day.
Deuteronomy 21:18-21 God demands we kill disobedient teenagers
Leviticus 20:13 God demands we kill homosexuals
Deuteronomy 22: 13:21- He demands to kill girls who are not virgin when they get married.
From you tube, I have similar questions presented on this particular video clip.
|
|
|
Post by violet on Sept 9, 2008 23:38:03 GMT 10
Ibig sabihin God kills innocent people-
mahabang explanations to, about killing? all are bound to die talaga, dahil the wages of sin is death
antay muna meh ng ibang sagot..
|
|
|
Post by Always on Sept 10, 2008 9:51:58 GMT 10
Intelligent or hard-core atheists/agnostics would not even dare asking these things since they already knew the form usage being formed in the translation of the scripture. The only thing I really anticipate about skeptics like you is your extreme misconception about the Holy Bible. And I love it because it is the only way I could appreciate in pointing you to the right direction inasmuch as for the Christian readers of P7.
As you may not know yet, the Bible being translated in the 17th century used the archaic form of modern English even though in the last 400 years or so, it is only then that English significantly changed. Good thing that you also posted the word "Ten Commandment" as a backdrop because it also shows your ignorance of the true meaning of the Sixth Commandment: Thou Shall not Kill.
As is with English, Hebrew, the language in which the first testament of the Bible was written, the verse being translated "Thou shall not kill." in old Hebrew is correctly translated as "You shall not murder." in modern Hebrew translation.
Because: The original Hebrew word being used is the term RATSACH or intentional killing without cause. Thus, the basic modern English translation of the phrase is: "Do not put anyone to death without cause."
Now that the first phase of my explanation has been posted, we now go to the main topic as to why God kills innocent people. I would like to show things in details but I'd like to make this an exception. The very reason why is because the verses you posted here were all due to the very basic tenets of of the original Hebrew word Hattx from the primitive root word atx meaning to sin, going the wrong way or incur guilt. Read the whole chapter of Levicticus 20; it is about how to sanctify one's self.
The transliterated word used was Chatta'ah from the root word Chata' and the word being translated in the Bible were as follows:
* sin * sin offering * sinful * sinner * punishment * purifying * purification for sin
in fact, Violet was right when she mentioned that the wages of sin is death. And what is this death that you try to correlate with KILL? The death written in the Bible simply meant separation from God as punishment of killing their spirituality - Spiritual Death.
KILL = PUNISHMENT = SPIRITUAL DEATH
How about an adverse metaphor for example:
A friend of mine in the bar smokes too much and it's always giving him a hard time. So I say & ask everytime I see him: "Why don't you just KILL that old habbit of yours?"
Only these for now P7ers until the Canaanites are mentioned here if the children are truly innocents
|
|
|
Post by leanne. on Sept 11, 2008 12:01:37 GMT 10
Galeng ng research ha , Yan lang ang mahirap sa bibliya, pag binasa mo ng pa basta, ganyan nga ang mangyayari, pero bakit kaya ganyan hindi gaya ng ibang libro madaling intindihin nga naman, ano kayang purpose ng Diyos at ang pagkakasulat ay parang mahirap arukin?
|
|
|
Post by leanne. on Sept 11, 2008 12:09:16 GMT 10
Meron meng nabasang libro ni Smith Wigglesworth, kami ni ate linsi, na dun, talagang tumubo ang mga paa ng isang tao na pinag pray nya, ;D pero ang alam ko indi natin mararanasan ang mga ganito katindi na healing ng basta. Ang tao kse ngayon mas gustong unahing makita yung himala kesa sa unahing makilala ang Diyos. At pag walang himala i-isyuhan din nila. Pareho lang
|
|
|
Post by Always on Sept 11, 2008 23:47:43 GMT 10
Galeng ng research ha , Yan lang ang mahirap sa bibliya, pag binasa mo ng pa basta, ganyan nga ang mangyayari, pero bakit kaya ganyan hindi gaya ng ibang libro madaling intindihin nga naman, ano kayang purpose ng Diyos at ang pagkakasulat ay parang mahirap arukin?
Thanks for the compliment
The YouTube made me curious so I clicked on it; and to my surprise, the author of that video clip tried so hard to sway Christians as being delusional of such belief in God. He even mentioned that the Bible was unscientific to begin with and yet he cited that 3 out of 4 medical doctors believed that God helped them in healing their patients.
To me 75% is scientific enough coming from a poll result.
But let me ask Rafael to do a li'l research for us about the "Wall of Jericho" because a scientific term called Sound Wave was used to crumble said wall. So my question now is, how did the people in that century knew the process? Is it about an imaginary god telling them so or was it a True God guiding them so?
The science of archaelogy proved such event to be true. So how would a primitive civilization knew such method when using trumpets could cause both longitudinal sound and traverse waves through solids with shear stress & pressure? How?
Perhaps a Higher Entity told them so and not just an imaginary one
|
|
|
Post by rafael on Sept 12, 2008 2:24:16 GMT 10
Kill is synonimous to slay, murder, dispatch, execute or to deprive of life. People of the old testament know that even people of today know that when you kill you slay. It is a biblical tradition to kill an adulterer by means of stoning to death. The studies about kill or murder or seperation by spiritual definition dilute the idea about killing.
|
|
|
Post by rafael on Sept 12, 2008 2:29:33 GMT 10
Going back to killing innocent people, by example about the flood brings us to notice about children who died in that flood. Sodom and Gomorrah were burned with innocent children to death. This is the main focus of my argument.
|
|
|
Post by rafael on Sept 12, 2008 2:48:12 GMT 10
To me 75% is scientific enough coming from a poll result.
But let me ask Rafael to do a li'l research for us about the "Wall of Jericho" because a scientific term called Sound Wave was used to crumble said wall. So my question now is, how did the people in that century knew the process? Is it about an imaginary god telling them so or was it a True God guiding them so?
If we are discussing the old testament of your bible, the only presentation found are people who worshipped their god by making noise using instruments.No one at that time pressumably explained about sound waves thus the wall was torn down.
The Greeks were successful in entering the city of Troy against a formidable wall, with the help of a goddess the city was destroyed and conquered. Both stories have each supernatural beings.
|
|
|
Post by rafael on Sept 12, 2008 3:01:38 GMT 10
Meron meng nabasang libro ni Smith Wigglesworth, kami ni ate linsi, na dun, talagang tumubo ang mga paa ng isang tao na pinag pray nya, ;D pero ang alam ko indi natin mararanasan ang mga ganito katindi na healing ng basta. Ang tao kse ngayon mas gustong unahing makita yung himala kesa sa unahing makilala ang Diyos. At pag walang himala i-isyuhan din nila. Pareho lang
Reading that book does not settle the argument. Why would not any amputee experience healing by growing a foot or both? If God heals then all should be .
|
|
migy
Moderator
moderator in his designated rooms
Posts: 2,544
|
Post by migy on Sept 12, 2008 7:53:55 GMT 10
Hi People,
It is the Faith that Brings Us Closer to God... and Without Faith we cannot Please God...
Mathew 9:2 Then behold, they brought to Him a paralytic lying on a bed. When Jesus saw their faith, He said to the paralytic, "Son, be of good cheer; your sins are forgiven you
John 6:29 Jesus replied, "This is the work of God: that you believe in the One He has sent."
Mathew 9:22 But Jesus turned around, and when He saw her He said, "Be of good cheer, daughter; your faith has made you well." And the woman was made well from that hour.
Mathew 17:20 So Jesus said to them, "Because of your unbelief; for assuredly, I say to you, if you have faith as a mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there,' and it will move; and nothing will be impossible for you.
We have to be grateful to God for the Air that we breathed yet we cannot see but we can feel it is there, the same as the Faith of Christians that believes that God sends His Son Jesus Christ to save mankind...
Can we count out hair, can count the stars, can we question God who made us - it's a matter of Choice my Friend... and we cannot question your choice also we cannot judge you, men cannot save men, God will remain as God and men has two choices in Life... Eternal Life or Eternal Judgment from the wrath of God according to His word...
If you believe that God Kills innocent People, it's your choice...
Do we have Freewill?
Psalms 119:108 Accept, I beseech thee, the freewill offerings of my mouth, O LORD, and teach me thy judgments.
We all have a choice! After All, We're all created by God, and we're all mortals...
We are the one's who's making Choices, God gave us Freewill, can you fathom the Power or God, can we tell how many stars therein? My Faith is to believe that He can do all things and believing that He is still in Control of everything...
I Chose to Contradict you about God kills innocent people, it is men who's making their choice, we are making our own pathways and God Has His rights to punish those who do not believe Him as it was written...
God is not the Author of Confusion, and if God doesn't confuse us, i believed that satan is confusing those who wants to believe the Word of God...
First Corinthians 14:33 says, "For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace." What man can do to his fellowmen…
If you have a question about tragedies and natural disasters, it is God's business not yours and who are you questioning God, where did you came from, don't tell me that you can explain how we exists?
God's Plan for us...
The Bible says there is only one way to Heaven
Jesus said: "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man comet h unto the Father but by me." (John 14:6)
We are Save by Grace (God’s Mercy) Good works cannot save you. "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." (Ephesians 2:8-9) (You cannot earn your salvation by either doing something or NOT doing something) Efeso 2:8-9 dahil sa kagandahang loob ng Diyos ay naligtas kayo sa pamamagitan ng inyong pananalig kay Cristo. At Ang kaligtasang ito ay kaloob ng Diyos, hindi mula sa inyo. Hindi ito dahil sa inyong gawa, kaya’t walang dapat ipagmalaki ang sinuman.
If you accept JESUS CHRIST as your Lord and Savior, "According to The Word of God We can be save..."
Did you know that We Are All Sinners?
For No One is Righteous before Him. All of Us are Sinners
“For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;" (Romans 3:23)
"Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:" (Romans 5:12) "If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us." (1 John 1:10)
Romans 6: 23 For the wages of sin is death; but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Whosoever Deny Jesus Christ……..
Mathews 10:33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father who is in heaven Whosoever Believed…
John 3:36 The one who believes in the Son has eternal life, but the one who refuses to believe in the Son will not see life; instead, the wrath of God remains on him. Be willing to turn from sin (repent).
Jesus said: "I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish." (Luke 13:5)
John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
"And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:" (Acts 17:30)
YOU DO HAVE A CHOICE
Believe that Jesus Christ died for you, was buried, and rose from the dead. "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) "
But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners. Christ died for us." (Romans 5:8)
"That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved." (Romans 10:9)
Through prayer, invite Jesus into your life to become your personal Saviour. "For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation." (Romans 10:10)
"For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." (Romans 10:13)
Since You have Prayed and Believed Jesus Christ! "But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:" (John 1:12) "Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new." (2 Corinthians 5:17)
A true witness delivereth souls: but a deceitful witness speaketh lies...Proverbs 14:25
|
|
migy
Moderator
moderator in his designated rooms
Posts: 2,544
|
Post by migy on Sept 12, 2008 8:51:45 GMT 10
Just wanted to share to you lastly Rafael....
BELIEVE it OR Not... GOD LOVES YOU SO, SO MUCH....!!!!
You maybe one inline wise individual of this world but men's knowledge is just nothing without God's guidance....
1 Peter 1:24-25 For all flesh is a grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away: v25 but the word of the Lord endureth for ever.
|
|
|
Post by Always on Sept 12, 2008 13:35:02 GMT 10
Kill is synonimous to slay, murder, dispatch, execute or to deprive of life. People of the old testament know that even people of today know that when you kill you slay. It is a biblical tradition to kill an adulterer by means of stoning to death. The studies about kill or murder or seperation by spiritual definition dilute the idea about killing.
I'm with a date right now; but this one needs immediate attention in order for my succeeding reply can be understood.
Rafael, don't dwell to much on literal meanings of certain words when it comes to justifying your argument. Instead, you should enforce your stand lexically. Why? Lexical meanings of the word KILL has different identifications. Can you tell me the difference between the Hebrew words Ratsach and Nakah? I really doubt that you know, unless you are well versed with them Lexically. Each one means KILL but different definitive identification.
Rafael, pakiPATAY mo nga ang ilaw
Are you gonna translate it in English as in:
Rafael, please KILL the light or
Rafael, please (turn)OFF the light
Tell us, what is the Pilipino translation of the word "OFF"?
and until you can show us the difference between the words RATSACH & NAKAH, I'll continue answering the others without confusion on your part.
One last thing is an adulterer an innocent person
Oh - I really love my date
|
|
|
Post by delta on Sept 12, 2008 14:13:48 GMT 10
|
|
migy
Moderator
moderator in his designated rooms
Posts: 2,544
|
Post by migy on Sept 13, 2008 18:16:33 GMT 10
|
|
|
Post by rafael on Sept 14, 2008 5:21:15 GMT 10
Come on, when you kill the light or turn off the light that means you stop the flow of electricity- need i say that when you kill a person, you stop the flow of life?
like " Kung hindi lang kasalanang pumatay_" or "patay kang bata ka, which means tragedy synonimous to death,.
|
|
|
Post by rafael on Sept 14, 2008 5:32:43 GMT 10
One last thing is an adulterer an innocent person
There is no such thing as convicted for life in those days, that is my point, a cruel and ultimate punishment were killing is quickly enforced.
Can you just admit that the god of the old testament is a cruel god?
|
|
|
Post by Always on Sept 14, 2008 12:52:41 GMT 10
One last thing is an adulterer an innocent person
There is no such thing as convicted for life in those days, that is my point, a cruel and ultimate punishment were killing is quickly enforced.
Can you just admit that the god of the old testament is a cruel god?
Is it not the the word "innocent" part of your topic? ;D
So, is an adulerer an innocent person?
And if in a subjunctive mood you were staying during that period, will you go against the law of the land? I doubt that you won't. However, to be convicted, there needed to be at least two witnesses. Hence the Bible also prescribes that people have the right to defend themselves against attack and use of deadly force if necessary.
|
|
|
Post by Always on Sept 14, 2008 13:25:45 GMT 10
|
|
|
Post by rowtide on Sept 16, 2008 9:05:53 GMT 10
Iba nga naman ang ilaw kaysa sa tao
|
|
|
Post by rafael on Feb 1, 2009 2:17:43 GMT 10
Paano if you "ON" it again eh di buhay ulet ito kaya you did not really KILL the light but merely interrupting its service. This is also analogous to the term RESSURECTION
It is not shameful to research the Holy Bible once in a while instead of reading outdated atheists' paraphenalias that causes you outright embarrasment.
I hope you now understand the different definitive usage of the word KILL.
VOW! Resurrection speaks only to those who believe. Illustration between light and life is entirely different. You haven't been resurrected (yet if there is such a thing) and so yours is considered a hypotheses yet to be proven.
|
|
|
Post by rafael on Feb 1, 2009 2:21:05 GMT 10
The great flood in Noah's time according to your bible killed all including children and there is no evidence of justice there to consider.
|
|
|
Post by supremo on Feb 1, 2009 9:49:03 GMT 10
The great flood in Noah's time according to your bible killed all including children and there is no evidence of justice there to consider.
Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. Is this not justifiable enough? You might use the "innocence" of the children to made your point of a merciless God of the bible yet: Gen 6:6 And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.God felt the same way as you felt raphael, but if your in the shoes of God what will you do?? Will you segregate the children knowing beforehand that they will do the same thing as what their parents did before?? Noah's family is spared yet after the flood, evil still exist continually. What more if those children where spared?? Yes, im not in a position to describe the state of the people in Noah's time coz i'm not there but i believe talagang SAKSAKAN NG SAMA nung panahon na iyun kaya God have to do this kahit na ikalungkot pa nya.
|
|
|
Post by leanne. on Feb 2, 2009 7:38:37 GMT 10
Galeng ni supremo
|
|
|
Post by Always on Feb 2, 2009 17:31:13 GMT 10
"Resurrection speaks only to those who believe. Illustration between light and life is entirely different. You haven't been resurrected (yet if there is such a thing) and so yours is considered a hypotheses yet to be proven."
Hypotheses you say?
I'd rather call resurrection a Preternatural(this is our word for the day) one or anything existing outside of nature until such time science found its niche to prove its existence. Or did science is already on the verge of proving it to be true?
Did we not argue about cryogenics before? Resurrecting the dead is almost the same as the science of cryogenesis and in fact, there are existing animals [suprised?] yes, the are exisitng animals and insects that could perform cryogenics in themselves. And scientists have already been working on such procedure in human tissues and body parts.
Examples of these animals & insects are goldenrod gall flies, Mantis Reliogiosa or female praying mantis, and bugsicles just to name a few. Within them, they possessed the knowledge of cryogenesis as it occurs when they freeze themselves solid with no heartbeat, and all metabolic functions are reduced to zero in a way it is termed as clinically dead at human level. But they have the way of coming back to life in order continue their role in the eco-system. Can't you just imagine the intelligent design of such order within nature?
Even though this is not in the exactness of God's science, the analogy between them in a figurative language for human (us) to understand is the revelation of what's to come. We must understand that even before scientists find out scientific theories, hypotheses, and laws to be true in nature, most of them were already preternaturally mentioned in the Holy Bible?
- It was in the Holy Scripture that the world(earth) is round more than thousands in years ago before scientists & astronomers found it to be true;
- The 2nd Law of Thermodynamics has always been in the Bible even before it was discovered to be true.
and a lot more on how the language of human science figure it's way in understanding the language of God and His science.
THUS,
if you "ON" it again eh di buhay ulet ito kaya you did not really KILL the light but merely interrupting its service. This is also analogous to the term RESSURECTION
Because the soul of every lamp, incandescent bulb, and or flourescent in the world is electricity because without it, you only have the physical aspect of the object - the Body.
VOW!
|
|
|
Post by Always on Feb 2, 2009 17:44:53 GMT 10
Galeng ni supremo Talagang magaling yan si Kuya at bilib ako jan na parang Lucky Me's Batchoy Supreme]. !!!
|
|
migy
Moderator
moderator in his designated rooms
Posts: 2,544
|
Post by migy on Feb 2, 2009 19:48:45 GMT 10
to add up your team giving Glory to God naku pow... kailangang mag study to go streamline na makasabay sa inyo... kaya nga po tahimik si ako, read mode lang talaga... a Blessed Personality po sa inyong katauhan, sempre to God Be The Glory pa rin... a Healthy and senseful of exchanges, thanks to mr.exdobal, rafael, parekoy (always), supremo, linsi, leanne, ruth, violet, tuya mhel, ib, jiro and more, funny moment with charlie and more... thanks to all our admins - very reponsible po talaga sila... yung mga di ko nabanggit special mention po yun, sorry po medyo bumabata tayo...
|
|